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I'm a 23 year old student from Cork, who quite enjoys having the odd rant/informed discussion about things.

Monday, August 17, 2009

Free speech....or maybe a nominal fee?

"Life isn't black or white. It's a million shades of grey." I have no idea who first coined that phrase, but for me it's attributed to my father. Definitely one of his wiser musings I feel. That's where so much conflict arises these days, isn't it?So many people think that way. 'X' is either black or white, right or wrong. The end. For most of us, we have evolved far enough to realise that life has the unfortunate habit of just not being that damn simple. However, are there not some things which we all have to agree are of paramount importance, that are definitively 'right' or 'wrong'?

Such as the importance of free speech for example. Surely that's a black and white issue. Right? Er...well...maybe. Personally, free speech is one of the things I hold dear. We are all entitled to our own opinion. Some people's opinions are downright ridiculous, no doubt. They are entitled to them nonetheless. I may not agree with what someone is saying, but I will defend to the death their right to say it. And that's where I often run into difficulty, unfortunately. I often get into trouble for having a habit of playin devil's advocate a bit too much. I see great importance in seeing all sides of an argument, that's all.

The most recent example to get me thinking on this is an incident in Greater Manchester recently, where a street preacher and his father were "threatened with arrest" for preaching the Bible in public. The particular verses he was citing included the passages Romans 1.27 and 1 Corinthians 6.9 from the King James Bible:

"And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust toward one another; men with men working that which is unseemly..."

"Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolators, nor adulterers, nor effiminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind."

Well you don't have to be a genius to work out what ol' preacher was getting at. More than likely it was the evils of homosexuality. Apparently he was threatened with arrest for "offensive" statements, which to some, amount to incitement to hatred. Now, see, that's were I get a bit stuck. I came across the story on a progressive Anglican blog, and one of my favourite blogs in general. The author, who I think is a brilliant man who writes very scholarly and articulate articles, takes this view. As someone advocating reform and inclusion in the Church of England and wider Anglican Communion, he believes the preacher's selective Bible quoting is incitement to hatred. I'm not so sure I agree on that. Oh I have been on the recieving end of many a fire-and-brimstone merchant, whose empassioned recital of the above Bible passages have certainly gotten on my nerves from time to time. That relentless evangelical zeal can be hard to escape (especially the American "missionaries" that seem to love Ireland so much). The guy in this article, as with many of them, has a preoccupation with the "sinfulness" of homosexuality. Which I disagree with, naturally enough. They are at best highly amusing and at worst downright annoying. But do they have a right to stand at the side of the street and tell I'm going to hell? Well, yes, I believe they do. I don't see it as incitement to hatred. They don't seem to be advocating harm against gay people. Now I know many will argue that they do untold psychological harm to vulnerable gay people, and I wholeheartedly agree. I was one of those people damaged for many years by negative ideas of homosexuality given by religion, so I know. That doesn't change my belief that religious conservatives or evangelicals such as this guy have a right to preach in public though. People are free to make up their own minds. I don't think some zealot screeching "REPENT! Lest the Devil shove a poker up your..." is incitement to hatred. Now, if it's a case of someone actively advocating harm against homosexuals (or anyone) then that's different. The likes of Fred Phelps and his WBC nutters or many extremist Islamic clerics advocating violence and death against gay people is completely wrong, and in that case, free speech is being violated to incite hatred. The current plight of gay men in Iraq is a sad example.

You can apply the same logic to racism, Islamophobia, sexism, etc. But there lies another question, which the author on the Changing Attitudes blog and many others would rightly raise: would the same rules apply to other groups apart from homosexuals? Would any form of racist sentiment be tolerated by free speech, for example? That's I good argument. I would refer to the "white nationalists" of Stormfront I mentioned in a previous post: are they entitled to espouse "white nationalism" as an ideology, once the don't advocate harm to ethnic minorities? I suppose, going on my own reasoning, that provided they don't advocate harm against ethnic minorities, then yes, they are entitled to believe white people are better than black people. However, the problem is, racism and Neo Nazism are rarely purely ideolgogical principles. They are based on hatred, rather like Fred Phelps and his attitude to gays, and require action. So they advocate harm to people, therefore are not entitled to propagate their opinion. But is someone who expresses concerns about immigration policy necessarily a racist? I don't think so.

I think it is an incredibly tricky issue. A lot of common sense is needed. There is a glaring difference between expressing concern about Islamic fundamentalism, and inciting Islamophobia. With relation to religion, most religions believe that theirs is correct; therefore others must be "wrong". They seek to save the unbelievers, therefore must attempt to prosletyse them. This involves telling them that their religion, or lack thereof, is wrong. And they are entitled to do so. Most of us would have the common sense not to tell people of other faiths they will go to hell, even if we believed so. However some people feel it is their duty to save the world from itself. And however idiotic it may be, they do have a right to express their opinion. As a Christian, I do tend to get a bit annoyed when people deliberately say offensive things about Jesus to piss me off. The idea of living in a nanny state that tells them they can't "commit blasphemy", however, pisses me off a great deal more. As offensive a person's opinion may be, I think once they are not advocating harm, slandering or libeling anybody, then they are free to say what they like. There's no litmus test for offence, unfortunately. Some people have incredibly thick skins, others don't. I think another thing that often gets forgotten about free speech and other civil liberties is that they work both ways. Take Bible Billy and his holy rolling friends: we gays espouse our right to freely contradict his views, don't we? So doesn't he have that same right? "But he's in the wrong!" you say. Maybe. But to him we're in the wrong. So one of us is wrong, but who decides which one? That's why free speech and debate are vital.




5 comments:

Suem said...

Interesting. I am also torn on this issue. I do believe in free speech but I also think there are limits. As for the case in Manchester, I really don't see why law abiding citizens going about their daily business should hear their lives and relationships described as sinful or perverted. Would it be acceptable to harangue heterosexual people on the street about sex before marriage, or make racist comments? Moreover, although to most sensible people, such preachers are simply a public nuisance , there are still cases of violence against the gay community and such comments can give some the pretext they need.

However I do support the right for people to believe and say homosexuality or sex before marriage is wrong - but they need to be more careful about the context in which that is said ( ie not public places, the workplace etc) My main difficulty is to what extent religious organisations and contexts should be free to express potentially "offensive" views about sexuality if it is a matter of conscience to them? And what about issues of employment of gay people in such churches? It is a huge and difficult issue.

Cleo said...

I agree, it's extremely complex. As regards the acceptability of preaching at heterosexuals, many preachers would rail against fornication as well as homosexuality. Most straight people I know would find them laughable or perhaps annoying, but I don't think they would disagree with their right to stand there and preach. As regards racist comments, no that would probably not be acceptable.
Yes, there are cases of violence against the gay community, but I don't think most religious conservatives would advocate violence against the gay community. They tend to come from the rather patronising "love the sinner, hate the sin" perspective. :) I see where you're coming from though. People have to be very careful how they articulate their views, and have to make sure they cannot be construed as an endorsement of violence or hatred. They are entitled to find certain things immoral. I think they should definitely be allowed to express such views in public or in the workplace, but again, have to be careful to articulate them properly. The question of employment is even more of a minefield.
As regards clergy, I think the church should be allowed to impose certain restrictions on priests, eg celibacy, if they so wish. I don't agree with it enforced celibacy at all, by the way. But I think the church should be allowed to make up its own mind on the matter. When one considers issues such as other staff, like organists, or teachers in Catholic schools for example, well then I think state equality legislation should apply. I know that may seem a double standard. However the clergy are a special case, and I think churches should be free to make up their own mind. Obviously I would hope they would come to accept committed partnered clergy. But I think they must reach the decision themselves.

Suem said...

People are certainly entitled to find things immoral ( I certainly do sometimes!)but in this day and age, we must be careful not to express this in ways that could reasonably incite violence or intimidate others. So, I may believe sex before marriage is sinful, however if I use strong language criticising a colleague who is co-habiting, it is not unreasonable if they are offended. If I am in a senior position to them,then there is a power issue; they might well feel intimidated and it could be seen as workplace bullying.
I have really grappled with this particular issue and considered blogging on it, as I am a "free-speech sort of person". I think what is needed is a strong clause of "reasonableness". So, for example, if a colleague asks for an opinion, it is reasonable to be allowed to express it without reprisal! If however someone constantly directs gives unsolicited opinions that could be hurtful, that is not reasonable. I think if several members of the public were complaining, it was reasonable for the preachers to be asked to desist or moderate their comments.


Interesting though, I am watching the equality legislation with interest!

Cleo said...

I think you hit the nail on the head with your idea of "reasonableness", Sue. If a work colleaugue of mine was a conservative Christian, and believed homosexuality to be immoral, should they be allowed to say so to me? Yes, I think so. However, your point about someone who "constantly directs gives unsolicited opinions that could be hurtful, that is not reasonable" is entirely spot on. They are entitled to express their view in conversation, but are not entitled to keep on and on about the subject, which I would consider harrassment. I guess where I make the distinction. Free speech is a right which requires a responsible use which it doesn't always get, ubfortunately. :)

Suem said...

Hi,

I did blog on free speech and the equality legislation eventually, if you want to read it and if you check this blog - looks like you've been busy:)